Intel P35: Intel's Mainstream Chipset Grows Up
by Gary Key & Wesley Fink on May 21, 2007 3:45 PM EST- Posted in
- CPUs
Final Words
The P965 launch is still too fresh in our memory to ignore. It appeared the roughest launch in recent Intel memory with a BIOS a day, and sometimes several a day, in the early going. Many of the features did not work, or at least did not work consistently until several months of BIOS updates. While the hard work has paid off for manufacturers and P965 is now a capable chipset, it is still not the paragon of reliability that we normally expect of Intel chipsets.Contrast that to today's performance launch of P35, and the differences are striking. P35 is very mature at launch and is generally a joy to work with. That is not to say it is perfect, as manufacturers are still scrambling to fully support all the new added features of the chipset. The base performance, however, is stable, and P35 returns us to the confidence we normally feel for Intel chipsets.
Some will say this is the result of the fact that P35 is just a mild upgrade of P965, fixing what is wrong with that chipset. We don't agree, since features like 1333 processor bus and support for DDR3 memory to 1333 speed and beyond are significant additions that definitely impact performance. Also significant is full support for the upcoming 45nm Penryn processors. As you have seen in the P35 benchmarks these are not just minor "fixes" - they are features that have a significant impact in improving system performance. No doubt Intel did tweak the base P965 code in the process, and we are grateful for that, but P35 introduces too much new that improves performance to just be considered a respin.
Looking at the four motherboards evaluated in this launch review, it is clear that all of the boards are very good with existing features like memory to DDR2-1066 and the current 1066 processor bus. However, when we move into the new performance areas of 1333 processor bus, DDR3, and 1333 memory speed, the ASUS P5K3 and P5K twins have the edge over the Gigabyte and MSI offerings. The MSI and Gigabyte are very good boards, and BIOS updates received during testing have us expecting them to be the equal of the ASUS boards in another BIOS spin or two. In fact, the Gigabyte BIOS received this weekend moves the P35 DQ6 into performance parity with the ASUS boards in early testing. For now, however, the ASUS pair is more polished in their implementation.
You will not, however, have to suffer with the Gigabyte or MSI as they both perform exceptionally well with the components we now have. Any of the four platforms will provide a rock solid base for a new system, performing better than just about any P965 board we have tested. You will not have to struggle with these P35 boards as many of you did with early P965. We also fully expect the Gigabyte and MSI to mature quickly in the "added features and refinement" category of P35.
What we did find in testing the P35 boards is that BIOS tuning is paramount to extracting the best possible performance from each board. ASUS's BIOS is very mature at this point and the extra features like Transaction Booster and CPU Voltage Damper actually make a difference in the performance of the board. We have also noticed the manufacturers starting to open up the BIOS with settings that will greatly assist the enthusiast in extracting the best possible performance from this chipset. However, we would still like to see the ability to change chipset straps and additional memory settings in the high-end P35 products.
Overall performance of the P35 chipset was impressive with it constantly finishing at the top of our benchmarks. Even though the differences in scores were minimal at times, the level of consistency shown by this chipset was impressive. The addition of DDR3 memory support, the improved memory controller, and the upcoming 1333FSB processors indicate that this mainstream chipset is a force to be reckoned with both with today's components and those on the horizon.
In current games like Prey we found a 9% increase in frame rates between the ASUS P5K3 at 1333/1333 and the Gigabyte P35-DQ6 at 1066/1066. Granted, the move to a 1333 FSB provided about a 6% improvement in frame rates on the DDR2 platform. However, once lower latency DDR3-1333 is available we expect the combination of this memory and the switch to 1333FSB processors to possibly create double-digit improvements in applications that are memory bandwidth and latency sensitive. Our main concern at this time is the cost and lack of widespread availability for DDR3 memory. Latency and speed improvements are developing quickly for DDR3 but cost appears to be the biggest stumbling block for entry into this technology now. Hopefully this will not be an issue six months from now as DDR3 ramps up in both production and system installs at major OEMs.
The ICH9R brings improved disk performance and in early RAID 5 and 10 testing we are seeing a 2% ~ 4% improvement in certain applications when compared to the ICH8R. The ICH9 also blesses us with an additional two USB ports and improved performance. Typical benchmarks like HD Tach or HD Tune do not show a difference in USB performance over the ICH8R currently; however, we are seeing measurable improvements in write and read speeds under Vista when comparing the two chipsets and a few minor compatibility issues seemed to have been solved. While not up to the speed of NVIDIA's USB solution, it is nice to see Intel making incremental improvements quickly.
We have explained the benefits of the chipset and provided an early look at its performance potential. What are the drawbacks? The P35 performance is impressive and the chipset along with the first wave of boards seem to be very solid. The problem is the cost of entry might be more than one is willing to spend to upgrade from a recently purchased P965, 680i, 650i, or even 975X board. Power consumption was a concern for us. Based on the current chipset TDP ratings we expected the power envelope to be near the P965 or possibly improved depending upon how aggressive Intel implemented power saving features on this chipset. Instead, we end up with a chipset that now consumes more power than the 680i and requires even more elaborate cooling. Something the motherboard companies have obviously taken to heart by the amount of heat pipes on the boards now. We doubt all of it is really needed but it is amusing for the time being to see the manufacturers trying to outdo each other in both design and amount of aluminum they can squeeze into a three inch square space.
There is no doubt after testing P35 that it is clearly the best-performing chipset you can buy today. Intel has done an excellent job in the added features, and performance is superb. P35 is at its best in gaming and memory-intensive applications, where the performance improvements are most dramatic. If you are building a new system there is a lot to like with P35, and it all starts with improved performance.
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Comdrpopnfresh - Tuesday, May 22, 2007 - link
The power could be attributed to the DDR3. With it not being so mature there may be a lot of signaling going on that isn't necessary. Also- with all the new technologies, these boards simply have more going on on them. With more transistors on a cpu its is expected they will use more power- more connections and circuits on a board would mean the same. Everything is running faster too. The power consumption doesn't make sense given the lack of matching real-world performance enhancements, but as the article makes good sense in pointing out, Bios are a big contributing factor here.TA152H - Tuesday, May 22, 2007 - link
Except they ran the power tests with DDR2 on P35 based machines as well, and they were higher than P965 with the same memory. So, obviously, that isn't the cause in this instance.Gary Key - Tuesday, May 22, 2007 - link
After speaking with the board manufacturers and Intel, our original thoughts (briefings/white paper review) were confirmed that the additional circuitry required on the P35 DDR3 boards and in the MCH result in the increased power consumption on the DDR3 platform compared to the DDR2 platform. This holds true for the P35 DDR2 boards when compared to the DDR2 P965, the additional DDR3 circuity/instruction set is still active even though it is not being used. This is why you will see the DDR2/DDR3 combo boards shortly. However, the BIOS engineers believe that can work a little magic with the SpeedStep and C1E wait states to reduce power consumption, however we are talking just a few watts at best. More on this subject in the roundup, at least we hope we will have more... ;)TA152H - Tuesday, May 22, 2007 - link
Gary,Thanks, it's useful to know. Are they going to shackle the x38 with DDR2 support too?
Just confirms my earlier opinion, they should have gotten rid of DDR2 support. Intel is an interesting company, they can come out with a great product like the Core 2, and then have some monkey decide to include DDR2 and DDR3 on the P35. You never know if they'll have a clue, or not. I guess it's a good thing they make turkeys like this and the P7, otherwise we wouldn't have AMD. Although AMD might be the cause of this.
The monkey that decided to do this probably thought, "Oh, look what we can do that AMD can't". It seems to me they did that with the P7, a technological marvel way beyond AMD's capability to design, thank goodness, and the groundbreaking Itanium. Except neither one worked great. AMD's pragmatism has paid off nicely, and even though they can't realistically support DDR2 and DDR3 on the same motherboard, I don't think they really care. Of course, I'm just guessing, when a company does something this stupid, it's always difficult to understand why they did it. It would have been so simple to just have DDR3 support for the P35, and let the P965 handle the DDR2 crowd. It's perfectly adequate.
Thanks again for the information. It's disappointing, but with Intel you get used to it. They can't do everything right after all, and still be Intel.
strikeback03 - Wednesday, May 23, 2007 - link
There might be a more practical reason, such as lack of production capability for DDR3 or HP and Dell threatening to use VIA chipsets instead of P35 in order to keep using DDR2 and keep their prices competitive. I doubt consumers would like their prices increasing by a few hundred dollars for no noticeable performance improvement. And if they only keep the computer 3 or 4 years they will probably spend less on energy than on that DDR3.Who knows about X38, I'd guess DDR2 support won't disappear until the chipset revision for Nehalem.
TA152H - Wednesday, May 23, 2007 - link
Well, I agree if P35 were the only choice from Intel, this would be the case, but again, would you buy VIA if you could get a P965? I wouldn't. If the P965 were a lousy, and seriously obsolete chipset, yes, sure, you'd have to come out with something that replaced it. But they could have easily validated it for FSB of 1333, and at the point the only thing really new in the P35 would be the DDR3 support. So, why would you need it?I was going to get the P35 rather than the x38 because I figure x38 will be even more of a power hog considering the, to me, useless features it has. I don't plan on getting two high-end video cards, and I don't think I will run anything that requires twice the performance of the current PCI-E, but if they drop the DDR2 support, it might the one to go after. If you ever look at an Athlon 64 CPU, you can see the memory controller is simply enormous, so dropping it on the x38 could be significant. With it being high end, they may decide DDR2 isn't a high end technology so they drop it. I hope so.
JarredWalton - Monday, May 21, 2007 - link
Could be the Vista factor? I dunno what else to think about the power numbers.XcomCheetah - Wednesday, May 23, 2007 - link
Could you do a little testing on it... why so high power numbers..Secondly if i remember correctly the power number difference between 680i and P965 chipsets was greater than 20W.. but in your current tests the difference is pretty small.? So any guess what has caused this positive change.?
Reference
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?...">http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?...
http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/chipsets/display/...">http://www.xbitlabs.com/articles/chipsets/display/...
current power numbers on Anandtech
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?...">http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets/showdoc.aspx?...